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exartemarte
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Pi4 Cooling

Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:54 pm

The over-temperature icon is flickering on and off continuously on the Pi4/4 I'm running as a second desktop, alongside my 'proper' desktop. It's fitted with heatsinks and mounted in a modified old-type official case with both side panels and the top cover left off. On current Buster it's running one program – the Chrome browser with two tabs open, one of them displaying a national newspaper and the other streaming BBC iPlayer Radio. It's not an especially warm day.

By and large I'm quite impressed with this new version, but I think we're kidding ourselves if we think it's suitable for use as a desktop without a cooling fan.

Edit: I note that the new Pi4 case, if you can get one, doesn't have the removable side panels and top cover, which will presumably make matters worse.

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clicky
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sun Jul 14, 2019 6:33 pm

Fan SHIM our favourite pirates are selling makes temperature under control at all times. After installing it I haven't seen it going over 49ºC at any point. And - it is solderless installation - so no need to 'dedicate' PI to run with that particular shim.

Alternative (from my perspective) is what I've done for my son's Orange Pi - made a case with fan 1cm away from PCB constantly working extracting air. I suspect that (even being enclosed) it would keep temperature low enough...

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exartemarte
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 10:49 am

Thank you for the suggestion. With an electronics background I do have reservations about anything electrical that relies on an interference fit for its connections, as this shim does. Nevertheless, I have bought one and installed it. It's running and seems to be doing what it says on the tin; somewhat to my surprise, it genuinely is completely silent. It will be interesting to see how it copes with the summer, if we get one.

For anyone with Amazon Prime it is worth noting that the shim is available at the same price there and with Prime you don't pay postage.

christopholous
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:33 pm

I'm going to try overclocking mine and running some stress tests. I do have a fan on mine, but it is on the case rather than right up to the cpu, so I'll see how it performs. Sounds like this shim fan would work well in overclocking situations.
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jamesh
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:08 pm

christopholous wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:33 pm
I'm going to try overclocking mine and running some stress tests. I do have a fan on mine, but it is on the case rather than right up to the cpu, so I'll see how it performs. Sounds like this shim fan would work well in overclocking situations.
It doesn't need much airflow of the board to cool it quite dramatically. I use the board with no case, and just the airflow around my desk keeps it to 55 or so at idle. Moving it to vertical orientation can drop it another degree or so, as the hot air flow is a bit more efficient rising past the board.
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exartemarte
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:23 pm

jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:08 pm
.. I use the board with no case, and just the airflow around my desk keeps it to 55 or so at idle ..
You have a tidier desk than mine!

wildfire
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:25 pm

My Pi 4b/4 idles* at around 57 C, with the fan shim attached it's around 36 C.

No case and running 1080p HDMI with only SD card, wireless keyboard & mouse. Nothing else attached.

*idling with desktop and 1 terminal window open. Ambient temp around 20 C.
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HawaiianPi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:46 pm

Mine is currently cooled by a quiet Noctua 40mm 5V fan in an open sided case with no heatsink.

In my experience, a fan works better than a heatsink alone (which only postpones the inevitable throttling). Fan and heatsink together will run cooler, but with a fan the heatsink is unnecessary. Watching 1080p videos on Youtube in Chromium Browser results in temps well below 50C (typically, 40-45C) and no throttling.

I'm using an old 2 layer acrylic case purchased for my 3B that works fine on the 4B with no modification. I have an SSD mounted on top and I have /boot on an SD card with the OS running from the SSD (only way to USB boot the Pi4 until the new firmware drops).

Image
Picture is my 3B, but 4B is configured the same way. This setup works great, and the SSD is much faster on the 4B's USB 3.0 port.

I do have a Pi4 Flirc case on pre-order, and that's what I'll be using when it arrives (most of my 3B/3B+ computers are in Flirc cases).
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exartemarte
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 5:40 pm

I have a couple of Pi's, including the above-mentioned second desktop, in cases stuck on the back of monitors and it's in one of those that I've put the fan. On robots and other hobby installations I've been known to use a case but mostly I just mount them on pillars. And a couple of Zero's in those very handy cases that also accommodate a camera. And three geriatric (first generation) Pi's running as servers: they're in cases because they didn't have mounting holes back then.

cruster
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 6:06 pm

One of these

https://uk.farnell.com/amec-thermasol/m ... dp/1892474

Plus
one of these

https://noctua.at/en/nf-a4x20-5v

=

<= 40C whatever I choose to do

wildfire
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 6:12 pm

IMHO...

Out of the various Pi's I've owned (zero's to 3b+'s) none of them needed active cooling. One of my 3b+ is in an argon one case which has both active (fan) and passive (case) and I can't recall the fan being activated at all.

The 4b I have (again IMHO) does need active cooling and I am awaiting Argon40 to replicate the argon one case I have for the 3b+. For now it has no home :cry: except a shoe box but it does have a fan and is happily working.
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american-pi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:52 pm

op, your not the only one experiencing this.
I had to return the official case as just opening up a web tab would trigger over temp icon every time.

Just got in my heatsinks from aliexpress, heck i am even going to HS the back side of usb2 and usb3 ports!
wish the case came with a little fan... i think we have a STEVE JOBs thing going on over at RPF......
NOBODY wants to admit these things are getting too hot!
OH well.

PhatFil
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:58 pm

Im interested to read how pi4.4gb works within the metal flikr case..

pfletch101
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:26 pm

PhatFil wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:58 pm
Im interested to read how pi4.4gb works within the metal flikr case..
I may eventually be able to tell you, but my Flirc case is currently even further back-ordered than my Pi 4.4! :)

wildestpixel
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:42 am

Im also using a Noctua 40mm x 10mm modded into the official POE HAT with some space above to let air in and going down onto a Pimoroni heatsink. All temperature controlled and kicks in at 50 degrees and keeps it there abouts.

No discredit to the genuine fan for the POE, but its not as quiet as the Noctua by a long shot (and not everyones going to be joining and shrinking wires and creating hysteresis profiles)

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Image
Image
Image
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wildestpixel
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:57 am

jamesh wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 4:08 pm
christopholous wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:33 pm
I'm going to try overclocking mine and running some stress tests. I do have a fan on mine, but it is on the case rather than right up to the cpu, so I'll see how it performs. Sounds like this shim fan would work well in overclocking situations.
It doesn't need much airflow of the board to cool it quite dramatically. I use the board with no case, and just the airflow around my desk keeps it to 55 or so at idle. Moving it to vertical orientation can drop it another degree or so, as the hot air flow is a bit more efficient rising past the board.
Also seen this on a naked board they are fine solo without a hat mountain on them or a case that holds some heat in. I've another 4 which is naked and fine but is unobstructed.

SO, only a need for active cooling when you are creating a cosy environment blocking airflow, introducing extra heat sources etc.

And as for the Arduino's in my flock - they have every other quirk under the sun besides temps!

My enclosed smaller "projects" are on Zero W's where thermals are much different - so 2 different usage scenarios. I wouldn't waste the meat of a Pi4 on a great deal of those projects and similarly a PiZero W doesn't cut it for what I use the Pi4 for.

It's all relative, and it's all gravy, or Turkish Delight.
Last edited by wildestpixel on Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
To infinity and the pond

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HawaiianPi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:58 am

pfletch101 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:26 pm
I may eventually be able to tell you, but my Flirc case is currently even further back-ordered than my Pi 4.4! :)
Pimoroni has the Pi4 4GB in stock (actually they have all 3 flavors in stock at the time of this post).
https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/rasp ... 7087445075

Okdo has 4GB in stock as well.
https://www.okdo.com/us/shop/raspberry- ... oard-only/

Flirc told me they're shipping in 3-4 weeks, 2 weeks ago.
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PhatFil
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Fri Jul 19, 2019 5:29 am

pfletch101 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:26 pm
PhatFil wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:58 pm
Im interested to read how pi4.4gb works within the metal flikr case..
I may eventually be able to tell you, but my Flirc case is currently even further back-ordered than my Pi 4.4! :)
Hope the micro hdmi cable/s are also on order/in your bits drawer if needed ;)
IM sure its gonna be worth the wait.. dont ya lurve the anticipation...

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HawaiianPi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Fri Jul 19, 2019 6:26 am

cruster wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 6:06 pm
One of these

https://uk.farnell.com/amec-thermasol/mpc222225t/heat-sink-ceramic-22-22-2-5-std/dp/1892474
MPC is good, but metallic copper foam is better.
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pfletch101
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:19 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:58 am
pfletch101 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:26 pm
I may eventually be able to tell you, but my Flirc case is currently even further back-ordered than my Pi 4.4! :)
Pimoroni has the Pi4 4GB in stock (actually they have all 3 flavors in stock at the time of this post).
https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/rasp ... 7087445075

Okdo has 4GB in stock as well.
https://www.okdo.com/us/shop/raspberry- ... oard-only/
I don't want to cancel an existing order (with Newark) that is supposed to ship in a week and then discover that someone else's web site has not kept up with their stock!
Flirc told me they're shipping in 3-4 weeks, 2 weeks ago.
Yes, that's what they told me at about the same time.

pfletch101
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:23 am

PhatFil wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 5:29 am
pfletch101 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:26 pm
PhatFil wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:58 pm
Im interested to read how pi4.4gb works within the metal flikr case..
I may eventually be able to tell you, but my Flirc case is currently even further back-ordered than my Pi 4.4! :)
Hope the micro hdmi cable/s are also on order/in your bits drawer if needed ;)
IM sure its gonna be worth the wait.. dont ya lurve the anticipation...
Well, at least the power supply came today! I run all my Pis headless, so I am hoping not to need HDMI cables. If I do, Frys is down the road and has some in stock.

trejan
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:24 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:58 am
Flirc told me they're shipping in 3-4 weeks, 2 weeks ago.
They posted an update on Reddit on Wed. They didn't ship this week so the 3-4 week estimate is still correct.
Still looking like regular cases will go out this week or early next week. Kodi cases should go out end of next week. I’m getting them in batches so ping me and I can figure out where you are in the queue.

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HawaiianPi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:13 am

pfletch101 wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:19 am
I don't want to cancel an existing order (with Newark) that is supposed to ship in a week and then discover that someone else's web site has not kept up with their stock!
Newark has no clue whatsoever when they will ship. They're just making up the "Expected ship date" at this point. My launch day June 24 order was July 5, then 10, then 12, then 16, then 22. Each time the ship date got close they just pushed it back a few days so it didn't look too bad.

What's that old saying... fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. After being punk'd 4 times I gave up and ordered a 4GB from Pimoroni along with an official PSU (which neither Newark or Okdo had) and a Fan Shim. Didn't really need the Fan Shim, but it's just so cool (literally and figuratively). Actually, didn't need the official PSU at this point either, but it's always nice to have one and it didn't affect the shipping charge, so why not.

Hope you have better luck with Newark then I did (at least there are 2 more available now).
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pfletch101
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:39 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:13 am
pfletch101 wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:19 am
I don't want to cancel an existing order (with Newark) that is supposed to ship in a week and then discover that someone else's web site has not kept up with their stock!
Newark has no clue whatsoever when they will ship. They're just making up the "Expected ship date" at this point. My launch day June 24 order was July 5, then 10, then 12, then 16, then 22. Each time the ship date got close they just pushed it back a few days so it didn't look too bad.

What's that old saying... fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. After being punk'd 4 times I gave up and ordered a 4GB from Pimoroni along with an official PSU (which neither Newark or Okdo had) and a Fan Shim. Didn't really need the Fan Shim, but it's just so cool (literally and figuratively). Actually, didn't need the official PSU at this point either, but it's always nice to have one and it didn't affect the shipping charge, so why not.

Hope you have better luck with Newark then I did (at least there are 2 more available now).
FWIW, I received my official PSU from Newark today - pity I haven't got anything for it to power!

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HawaiianPi
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Re: Pi4 Cooling

Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:22 am

HawaiianPi wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 4:58 am
Flirc told me they're shipping in 3-4 weeks, 2 weeks ago.
Checked my email before going to bed and found this. Image
flircorder.gif
flircorder.gif (1.91 KiB) Viewed 3087 times

Thank you for your order from Flirc.tv! We wanted to let you know that your order was shipped via USPS First Class Mail on 7/23/2019.
You can track your package at any time using the link below.

Shipped To:
Hawaiian Pi
0000 STREET ST
ALOHA, OR 00000 US

Track Your Shipment: 000000000000

This shipment includes the following items:
Item # Description Qty
FL-10270 Flirc Raspberry Pi 4 Case 1


It's on its way! Image
pi4-case.jpg
pi4-case.jpg (17.53 KiB) Viewed 3087 times

EDIT:
My 4GB Pi4 from Pimoroni has also cleared customs and is in the hands of the US Post Office, so that's racing the Flirc case here. :D

Oh, and my new smartphone is supposed to be delivered today!
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