Page 2 of 4

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:28 pm
by jamesh
Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:10 pm
Every time I use Etcher to write a Pi image I have to go through three level of permissions in Win10.
I am so sick of that.

Perhaps the next version of the Pi Keyboard can be USB 3 with an uSD card writer built in?
Really? Just works for me - one dialog saying "Making changes, are you sure" and that's it.

Even if the keyboard did have that, you would still need software to drive it - which is where Etcher comes in.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:02 pm
by LTolledo
Gavinmc42 wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:10 pm
Every time I use Etcher to write a Pi image I have to go through three level of permissions in Win10.
I am so sick of that.
Just flashed a USB thumb drive with Raspbian Buster Desktop Full (for my RPi3B+), using Balena Etcher.... on a W10 laptop

odd...I didn't have to go through three levels (or even a single level) of permissions....

just select image, select target, and start... wait until finish, eject target.


.....methinks something fishy about your W10 setup.... :shock:

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 3:55 pm
by jamesh
jcyr wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:53 pm
You need privilege to delete or add partitions to a device under Windows 10. The Windows 10 UAC prompt tells you that Balena is attempting such a privileged operation. Something you'd probably want to be aware of.

A popular Windows app, CCleaner, which I've deleted due to its recent introduction of obnoxious promotional pop-ups, by default installs a privileged Windows background service to get around the UAC prompt. You can disable it, but it is installed by default. Bad behavior as far as I'm concerned. Using the privilege of the installer to gain application privilege is something the user should be made aware of, not silently installed by default.

I'm surprised that Windows 10 users would not be seeing the UAC prompt when writing Raspian to an SD card.
I get in once on Win10, as expected.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 7:51 pm
by Imperf3kt
UAC can be disabled or made even further restricting. The choice is available to the end user.
I'd suggest checking what it's set to. It should never be disabled, but neither should it ask you if you meant to move your mouse an inch.


Regarding "data collection", why not just use it offline, or add Balena's servers to your firewall's block list if you're that worried about it.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:04 pm
by bomblord
Rufus (windows only) is my recommendation.

It's usually 2/3 clicks (choose image and click start) to install any OS I've thrown at it including Raspbian, Linux Mint, Windows 10, Gentoo Linux, and Pop OS. It also works with both UEFI and non-UEFI boot. It's also tiny, free, adfree, and has a portable version.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:14 pm
by Roken
Ermm - what ads

Disclosure. Arch Linux user, and I don't recall a single ad anywhere.

Is this, by any chance, part of the ad supported model that Windows has adopted?

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:33 pm
by wren
If you're on Mac or Linux. dd program size 80 KB vs 80MB etcher
dd if=/path-to-image of=/path-to-sdcard

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:50 pm
by Imperf3kt
wren wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:33 pm
If you're on Mac or Linux. dd program size 80 KB vs 80MB etcher
dd if=/path-to-image of=/path-to-sdcard
Does this also extract the image from its compressed zip and warn you if you've specified the wrong drive? (Etcher actually chooses for you, so that's unlikely)

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:55 pm
by trejan
Roken wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:14 pm
Is this, by any chance, part of the ad supported model that Windows has adopted?
No. This has nothing to do with Microsoft. There is an "advert" for their balenaSound project guide ("Turn your old speakers or Hi-Fi into Bluetooth receivers with a Raspberry Pi and this step-by-step guide") when you're writing an image.

If the advert isn't intrusive then I don't mind it even if they do change it to a commercial product. It should respect the data collection toggle though.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:03 pm
by Imperf3kt
trejan wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:55 pm
Roken wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:14 pm
Is this, by any chance, part of the ad supported model that Windows has adopted?
No. This has nothing to do with Microsoft. There is an "advert" for their balenaSound project guide ("Turn your old speakers or Hi-Fi into Bluetooth receivers with a Raspberry Pi and this step-by-step guide") when you're writing an image.
I've not seen that one

The last ad I saw was for Balena designed compute module 3+ baseboards.

I'm not sure if advertising for a Pi product is something to complain about when flashing an OS image for a Pi product.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:11 pm
by trejan
Imperf3kt wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:03 pm
I've not seen that one

The last ad I saw was for Balena designed compute module 3+ baseboards.
https://i.imgur.com/wugNSaS.png is the balenaSound advert.
Imperf3kt wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:03 pm
I'm not sure if advertising for a Pi product is something to complain about when flashing an OS image for a Pi product.
Yeah. If balena want to advertise their own products or guides which are Pi related then I don't have a problem with it. I'd quickly change my mind if it turned into the usual clickbait adverts though.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:16 pm
by DougieLawson
Curiously I'd not noticed any ads with Etcher. It takes long enough that I'll set it going then visit the small room for a comfort break (including reading some pages in Private Eye) followed by the kitchen to make a pot of tea then come back to my laptop to see Etcher ejecting the USB device.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2019 1:04 am
by LTolledo
Am also not a person who eagerly wait while watching Etcher writes and verifies the flashing of an image. :D

"...ignores privacy..."? :o am I missing something?
where and what process in Etcher where it "intrudes privacy"

gosh hope it's not peeking while am changing clothes... :shock:

:mrgreen:

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2019 2:29 am
by wren
Imperf3kt wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:50 pm
Does this also extract the image from its compressed zip and warn you if you've specified the wrong drive? (Etcher actually chooses for you, so that's unlikely)
Surely worth 79.75MB more disk space.
unzip -p | sudo dd if=/image of=/drive

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2019 4:04 am
by scaramonga
rotation wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:40 am
So now that the new BalenaEtcher contains ads and ignores privacy settings, what is a good replacement for Etcher?
The previous version, without ads ;)

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2019 6:13 am
by rotation
scaramonga wrote:
Fri Sep 27, 2019 4:04 am
rotation wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:40 am
So now that the new BalenaEtcher contains ads and ignores privacy settings, what is a good replacement for Etcher?
The previous version, without ads ;)
Well, I do have an old(er) version of Etcher installed.

When I open it I get an error message "Cannot read property 'UPDATE_NOTIFIER_SLEEP_DAYS' of undefined".
Which version would be the last one without ads?

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:07 pm
by bjtheone
wren wrote:
Fri Sep 27, 2019 2:29 am
Imperf3kt wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:50 pm
Does this also extract the image from its compressed zip and warn you if you've specified the wrong drive? (Etcher actually chooses for you, so that's unlikely)
Surely worth 79.75MB more disk space.
unzip -p | sudo dd if=/image of=/drive
If you are familiar with the vast range of command line tools and shell commands available they are always going to be faster and more flexible. However, dd will happily do whatever you tell it to, without all the hand holding. Almost everyone who has mucked about with Unix or Linux has a sad "rm -rf" story, especially if you decided to get cute with "find" and went walking symbolic links. (Hummm thats taking a long time, is never a happy making thought after issuing such a command)

Etcher is a easy to use tool, with a GUI, some handholding, and data validation. Plus it is easily installed on Windows and MacOs. Totally makes sense to recommend it to new folks. If you are comfortable with Linux, you likely did not need to ask since the easily found instructions make sense.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Sat Sep 28, 2019 8:31 pm
by spock
on windows i also like rufus best.

also it's like 100 times smaller than etcher. :) isn't etcher just a 100mb electron gui for a command line tool?

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:40 pm
by hippy
spock wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 8:31 pm
isn't etcher just a 100mb electron gui for a command line tool?
Quite possibly but I don't see that being a problem. 100MB is pretty much 'nothing' in the grand scheme of things.

The main advantage of Etcher is it's so easy to use, no need to figure out what options to set or to do anything other than to choose what one wants to write and what one wants to write it to, and that's often been pre-selected anyway.

It's clean, simple, and about as close to 'click and go' as one could get. Perfect for noobs and even advanced users who cannot be bothered with fussing about.

The 'adverts' I noticed but ignored, and I don't stare at it while it completes anyway. They weren't from what I recall 'adverts', not in the traditional sense, any way. More 'promos' and that's fair enough in my book for something so brilliant and useful yet free.

'Not respecting privacy' would be a legitimate issue but it's not clear if it is actually an issue, or an issue anyone should be overly worried about.

My only real complaint about Etcher is it doesn't run under Windows XP. But it seems neither does Rufus.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:01 pm
by tpylkko
So, if I want to use windows 10, I cannot write a disk image to a card/stick without special software? Win 10 itself cannot do it some how?

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:27 pm
by jamesh
tpylkko wrote:
Sun Sep 29, 2019 8:01 pm
So, if I want to use windows 10, I cannot write a disk image to a card/stick without special software? Win 10 itself cannot do it some how?
Correct.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:09 pm
by jahboater
bjtheone wrote:
Fri Sep 27, 2019 12:07 pm
Etcher is a easy to use tool, with a GUI, some handholding, and data validation. Plus it is easily installed on Windows and MacOs. Totally makes sense to recommend it to new folks. If you are comfortable with Linux, you likely did not need to ask since the easily found instructions make sense.
I just use cp, it is so so simple.

However I do agree that Etcher is the best recommendation for new users.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:53 am
by Moonmarch
If anyone using the RPI computer does not know how to install OS images without using Etcher,\ then you will have no choice other than to purchase a SD card that includes NOOBS, if you are using RPI4B computer you will need NOOBS version 3.2 to install Raspbian Buster or other supported OS, other versions of NOOBS will be compatible with the previous version of RPI computers.

If you have a SD card reader connected to the RPI computer you can write your own OS images there are several approaches to writing OS images to SD cards which requires more preparation or reading more guides in comparison to only using Etcher, if you need Etcher then you have no choice other than to use Etcher.

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:03 am
by jbudd
I just use cp, it is so so simple.
Can you give a bit more onfo on your so simple way to burn an SD card with cp?

Re: What is a good replacement for Etcher (ads and ignores privacy)

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 1:47 am
by bjtheone
Moonmarch wrote:
Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:53 am
If anyone using the RPI computer does not know how to install OS images without using Etcher,\ then you will have no choice other than to purchase a SD card that includes NOOBS, if you are using RPI4B computer you will need NOOBS version 3.2 to install Raspbian Buster or other supported OS, other versions of NOOBS will be compatible with the previous version of RPI computers.

If you have a SD card reader connected to the RPI computer you can write your own OS images there are several approaches to writing OS images to SD cards which requires more preparation or reading more guides in comparison to only using Etcher, if you need Etcher then you have no choice other than to use Etcher.
Not following your point in the first paragraph. You could easily buy a blank SD card and install NOOBS on it (there are many many many tutorials on how to do it and most of them are even correct), or could follow one of the command line Linux tutorials (its not like it is a lot of commands (download, unzip, dd) if you already have a Linux box.

The whole point of recommending Etcher is it mostly idiot proofs the process so at least a new person gets a working SD card that has a good chance of a successful first boot. Another big win is that it can be done from the "safety and comfort" of the Windows computer they most likely have and at least vaguely understand.

The part that blows my mind is the folks whose go to solution provider is youtube, rather than the folks that make the Pi. Perhaps the boxes should ship with a card with the url in giant flaming letters.