gregeric
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:29 am

I use mbed & to a lesser extent arduino devices for quick embedded development. Given the low price point and vastly increased grunt, many may choose Zero over arduino or mbed enabled devices, were such an IDE be available.

On the educational side, having mbed on Pi would allow smooth transition for users from the BBC microbit to Pi.

shuckle
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:37 am

I tried to build a backup system for my cameras.
I have 4 IP cameras and I wanted to backup the pictures to an USB disk on another server.
Raspberry was not able to handle the load due to combined high load on USB external disk and ethernet.
(I bought an odroid c1 and it is happily handling it. It has dedicated USB and GB ethernet.)

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:17 pm

In the exotic / unreasonable wish list category: have a camera that can record HD video with a high-speed strobe that illuminates the whole frame even with a short shutter time. This would require a global shutter camera instead of the much more common/ inexpensive rolling shutter, plus have a frame-start sync output signal, and is a niche use case so I'm pretty confident it will not happen. In fact, you can almost do this with the existing RPi camera, but you have to use shutter speed = 1/fps (frame rate) or in traditional film terms, a 360 degree shutter angle, so that limits the (strobe light / ambient light) exposure ratio. Also, AFAIK you can already do this with existing USB global-shutter cameras (starting around US$ 1000).

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:32 pm

Honestly, I would love more stability as a server. I used to have one server that ran everything and would get uptimes in the years. The longest uptime was almost 5 years. I've replaced that aging system with various Raspberry Pis. One pi runs my blog, another pi runs my file server, another pi runs my mail server, etc, etc. I am finding that the servers have to be restarted at least once a month. The software either crashes, or the pi just spontaneously turns off, etc. I'd love to just fire these devices up and forget about them.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 6:42 pm

septantrionalis wrote:Honestly, I would love more stability as a server. I used to have one server that ran everything and would get uptimes in the years. The longest uptime was almost 5 years. I've replaced that aging system with various Raspberry Pis. One pi runs my blog, another pi runs my file server, another pi runs my mail server, etc, etc. I am finding that the servers have to be restarted at least once a month. The software either crashes, or the pi just spontaneously turns off, etc. I'd love to just fire these devices up and forget about them.
It should be possible. I have a Pi in a data center that recently passed the 2-year uptime mark. However it is not doing much, just remote archive of some files every day, plus running asteroids@home to while away the time, and it sends me an email with the uptime once a day.

Code: Select all

11:57:01 up 747 days, 19:47,  0 users,  load average: 1.09, 1.08, 1.11
Last edited by jbeale on Fri Dec 04, 2015 10:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

stderr
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 7:48 pm

septantrionalis wrote: I am finding that the servers have to be restarted at least once a month. The software either crashes, or the pi just spontaneously turns off, etc. I'd love to just fire these devices up and forget about them.
Are you sure that the power you are giving them is sufficient? Or perhaps there's some sort of software bug. I have three pi that are just left running most of the time and I can't remember there being a problem with that. They are not overclocked.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:06 pm

stderr wrote:Are you sure that the power you are giving them is sufficient? Or perhaps there's some sort of software bug. I have three pi that are just left running most of the time and I can't remember there being a problem with that. They are not overclocked.
I have a total of 10 pi's that do various tasks (web cams, specific web services, load balancer, etc) and I've tried different power suppliers, different SD cards, different configurations, etc. Nothing works. Honestly, I shouldn't have to go through these lengths to get it to work so that's why I mentioned stability.

This is one power supply I've tried for example and this is the one running on my blog server.

http://www.adafruit.com/products/1995?g ... Ai_T8P8HAQ

I've given up on trying to make them run 24/7 and just have work arounds. My surveillance cameras are connected to timers that shut off and shut on once a day.

My web services are being monitored by uptime robot that sends me a notification for when they go down. I then restart them remotely using Wemo, which is a whole different issue in itself, lol.

Here's the uptime report for my blog server, which is the worst. All it runs is Wordpress with all of the appropriate components for wordpress-- apache2, mysql, php, etc.

Image

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jjex22
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 10:31 am

Well, I've given this thread some serious thought. Some great suggestions, but I think all in all, what I really want is for the model b/b+ and zero to fit perfectly in Lego cases...
I had the idea for a single board computer in every seat on airplanes... but it all just seemed a bit Pi in the Sky!

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:42 am

I want one that will pick guaranteed winning lottery numbers ;)

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:51 am

fruit-uk wrote:I want one that will pick guaranteed winning lottery numbers ;)
If a Pi had that the sales would be huge.

Everyone would be disappointed though, everyone would win, the payout would be worthless.
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 11:59 am

septantrionalis,

You seem to be having a lot of bad luck with your Pi. You sure your power supply, mains that is, is not glitching out occasionally?

Are sure your server software is solid? Not eating up all the Pi memory for example?

I recently had such issues with a node.js sever running an an Amazon cloud instance. No memory leaks in the server application but the node.js engine was merrily assuming it had gigabytes of memory to work in, rather than the 1GB it actually had.
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 1:52 pm

To many are more interested about the next Pi, when not fully understanding the first Pi

To many are more interested about the next project , before fully understanding the first project
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Chris-The-Tuner
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 1:56 pm

boyoh wrote:To many are more interested about the next Pi, when not fully understanding the first Pi

To many are more interested about the next project , before fully understanding the first project
*like*
Thats common with beginners specially with kids that want to look cool :D
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:02 pm

septantrionalis wrote:Honestly, I would love more stability as a server.
I would check the gauge of the cables providing 5v power to your Pii, although if you're using an Adafruit supply meant for a Pi, that should be good enough. You can't have a large enough gauge power cable, especially as length increases. Next, I would put an UPS with surge protection between the Pi and the AC/mains to filter out spikes, brownouts, etc. (you would not believe what some utilities put out nowadays). Here is the MoPower UPS hat I'm beta testing: viewtopic.php?f=45&t=127700. However, it's a kit that requires some fiddly surface-mount soldering of Really Tiny Parts, but nothing critical, just resistors and LEDs. Everything else is through-board wire leads or power regulators, an inductor, etc., with relatively large surface-mount solder pad areas.

Finally:
septantrionalis wrote:Here's the uptime report for my blog server, which is the worst. All it runs is Wordpress with all of the appropriate components for wordpress-- apache2, mysql, php, etc.
Well, there's one potential problem, Wordcrash. Seriously, you can have all sorts of problems if it isn't configured 1000% correctly, especially if it's handling a lot of traffic. Just ask the Foundation how they've had to pay an inordinate amount of attention to tuning for everyday activity, let alone when they keep tossing things like $5.00 computers out into the world and then are puzzled as to why they get suicide notes from Mythic Beasts, their hosting service :D Of course, this doesn't explain crashes on other Pii if they're not running that stack, so if more than one Pi is going Tango-Uniform around the same time, you almost certainly have a power problem of some sort. Looks like you're running a heartbeat monitor, so you should have that data.
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:39 pm

Some of the project I'd like to do with the Pi require a good HD throughput and a good Ethernet throughput at the same time. For example a NAS. That could be cured by providing a USB3 interface, which would be fast enough to handle both simultaneously. But the USB is in the SoC, so it would mean a new SoC and new drivers, and those were a pain the first time around.

Having a shutdown input and a power-off output would be useful for the people who want to embed a Pi in a car or whatever.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:47 pm

As for the topic, I would LOVE to have at least ten channels of analog I/O, with more channels being "more better". Yeah, it's fairly cheap to add ADCs or even do simple R2R ladders, etc., but it would just be nice to not have to strap an Arduino on just to get analog I/O. However, at less than a few bucks to run a pre-programmed AtMega328 DIP and the required discrete interface components, it is almost too easy and cheap. Plus, you can offload time-critical stuff from the Pi on the digital side if it's really busy, albeit, Arduino clock speed is not going to blow the side mirrors off of anything, let alone the doors :shock:

Like everyone else, getting a separate network channel into the SoC would be a big boon, and supporting 1.8v UHS on the (micro-)SD card interface would be really nice. The latter wouldn't be such a big deal if we had USB 3 to hang flash drives, HDs, and SSDs from for real I/O, especially writes. 4K video is becoming surprisingly common, so when the inevitable SoC comes along to support that, I'll be in line as much as I am for my hundreds of $5.00 Zeroes I'm going to give to every kid I meet on the street.

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"You're traveling through another dimension, a dimension not only of sight and sound but of mind; a journey into a wondrous land whose boundaries are that of imagination. That's the signpost up ahead - your next stop, the Pilight Zone. ... " [dee-dee dee-dee, dee-dee dee-dee, dee-dee dee-dee, dee-dee dee-dee ... da-da-da-da-dahhhh!] :o
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 3:34 pm

Heater wrote:
fruit-uk wrote:I want one that will pick guaranteed winning lottery numbers ;)
If a Pi had that the sales would be huge.

Everyone would be disappointed though, everyone would win, the payout would be worthless.
Yeah...they might sell--oh, I don't know--7 or 8 million of them. Oh, wait...

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 3:37 pm

Jim Manley wrote:You can't have a large enough gauge power cable, especially as length increases.
I wouldn't go *that* far...I recall dealing with #0000 stranded, and that was just ONE conductor.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 3:44 pm

rurwin wrote:Some of the project I'd like to do with the Pi require a good HD throughput and a good Ethernet throughput at the same time. For example a NAS. That could be cured by providing a USB3 interface, which would be fast enough to handle both simultaneously. But the USB is in the SoC, so it would mean a new SoC and new drivers, and those were a pain the first time around.

Having a shutdown input and a power-off output would be useful for the people who want to embed a Pi in a car or whatever.
Once I get my hands on a particular board linked to by a poster in another thread (UPS says it should arrive by Wednesday) and get a chance to examine and test it, there may be at least a partial solution. Western Digital makes a CM board that supports a SATA connection. If it has all the other features I want (I can't tell from the web page if it has an Ethernet connection), then the release of a CM2 would make it a really nice member of the Pi "family".

At present, WD has an introductory offer of $24 for the board, with an intended list price of $30, so--potentially--a $70 "Pi Server".

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 6:52 pm

To compare one Pi's stability, to a another Pi's stability in different environments will probably

give different results. Even if both Pi's.and power supply's are identical, This could be due to

not having control of the power supply in to the house. Yes you have control of your side of the

of the power supply. Mains power supply's stability can differ from location to location, and

nois content, so each Pi system might have be controlled separately. Also component tolerance

can make a difference
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karrika
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:58 pm

Munin is a very good tool for finding out why some node (like a Raspberry Pi) is unstable. I am using it to monitor small embedded stuff. It is normal to have uptime measured in months not hours.

Munin logs pretty much all resources like memory usage, processes, network problems. You get much better info of what goes wrong than just by looking at the system from outside.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Mon Dec 14, 2015 12:30 pm

Apologies to Jim, the discussion link he posted about the UPS was mine and I had to delete it due to concerns about commercial postings. Search for MoPower UPS in the for sale section if you are interested.

I will tell you from experience, most all of my own Pi stability problems were from power issues. Either from the grid, or usually from really bad USB power adapters and even a really bad cable once. I think only one time I had a bad SD card, all the rest were power problems of one kind or another. If you don't want to go the whole custom UPS route.. buy a known good USB power supply and cable, or use one from a brand name tablet or similar.

Regards,
-Moses
Power problems? MoPower UPS for the Pi
http://www.allspectrum.com/mopower/

rhubarb65
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Tue Dec 15, 2015 1:45 pm

My Pis have been pretty reliable, (Samba server,VPN gateway and more)

the main issues for me with the PI2 are

1 desktop performance. Web Surfing still not useable. Needs 50-100% more CPU and a couple more GBs RAM.

2 server performance. IO throughput too slow (2.5MB/s). Lose The USB - NIC hardware contention to hopefully double throughput.

None of this need cost much 10-20$ ? and we now have a low-end but useable desktop or server. This is the PI3 hopefully. There is SOOOO MUCH demand

USB3 and another CPU doubling in the PI4 and we have a sweet mid range

and yes I know this is not what the original Pi was about (Kids experimenting). But it is what the new Pis will become

Dont forget that the Kids need a desktop to find the info they need in order to experiment
Last edited by rhubarb65 on Tue Dec 15, 2015 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Tue Dec 15, 2015 2:50 pm

The question is all wrong. It should be:
How can people do with the RPi what they currently currently cannot do?
And the answers are quite simple:
1) Use better software
2) Write better software
3) Use the GPU (all parts) wherever possible (there's still a lot of unused potential), see 2)
4) Tell the web designers which use tons of Javascript where nobody needs it is to go to hell (meaning, don't visit their pages any more).

The Pi was developed for kids. They should learn to create great things with limited resources. That's what we all have to learn before the planet becomes inhabitable.
Don't cry for more power (CPU, GHz, RAM etc). Educate yourself to get along with what we have (not only the kids need education).
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Re: What do people want to do that the rpi currently cannot

Tue Dec 15, 2015 3:51 pm

rhubarb65 wrote:My Pis have been pretty reliable, (Samba server,VPN gateway and more)

the main issues for me with the PI2 are

1 desktop performance. Web Surfing still not useable. Needs 50-100% more CPU and a couple more GBs RAM.

2 server performance. IO throughput too slow (2.5MB/s). Lose The USB - NIC hardware contention to hopefully double throughput.

None of this need cost much 10-20$ ? and we now have a low-end but useable desktop or server. This is the PI3 hopefully. There is SOOOO MUCH demand

USB3 and another CPU doubling in the PI4 and we have a sweet mid range

and yes I know this is not what the original Pi was about (Kids experimenting). But it is what the new Pis will become

Dont forget that the Kids need a desktop to find the info they need in order to experiment
The SoC range used in the Pi only has a single USB channel in to the device, so throughput will always be an issue until a different range of SoC is selected. At which point, almost all the work done on optimising Raspbian and apps goes out of the window(new architecture, new GPU, new camera I/F, new DSI I/F, new GPIO system etc). So it's more than a $20 upgrade. It's definitely a limitation, but currently one with no sensible solution.
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