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Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:00 am
by SteveDee
Would selling Arm to Softbank be a disaster for the UK?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36822806

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:12 am
by RaTTuS
no not really ,

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:30 am
by jamesh
Was surprised to hear this, this morning. Not sure what to make of it. Just wish I had some shares!

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:17 am
by Burngate
At 1,742.85p each, even a couple'd be nice!

Apparently "Softbank is currently in debt to the tune of around $100bn" so $32 bn could be considered small change?

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:42 am
by PeterO
BBC news's headline writers get it wrong as usual

"ARM chipmaker to be bought"

PeterO

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:34 am
by hippy
PeterO wrote:BBC news's headline writers get it wrong as usual

"ARM chipmaker to be bought"
Already changed to "ARM chip designer". Almost every media outlet, including those who should know better, are headlining "chipmaker" so I guess that's what came over the wire from the agencies.

I was most impressed by the Chancellor's spin in calling it an "investment".

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:43 am
by Heater
So long ARM, and thanks for all the fish.

The British voters opted for leaving Europe. Thus crashing the pound. So now the world can move in and buy whatever goodies we have left at fire sale prices. People like Stuart Chambers can make a packet selling off the assets.

Luckily, when ARM goes down as a result (the Chinese really don't want to give their money to the Japanese), we have the RISC-V coming along nicely. :)

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:54 am
by mikerr
Apparently this deal only started after the brexit vote:

https://twitter.com/ArashMassoudi/statu ... 4896982016

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 2:27 pm
by gkreidl
This is terrible and yes, it has been made possible by the Brexit vote (they have to pay 30% less than two weeks ago).

SoftBank is a Japanese Telecommunication company that has already piled up debts of 100 billion US $. They desparately have to earn some money.
Analysts speculate that they plan to enhance the licence fees for ARM chips; it's like a kind of toll on the whole mobile and embedded industry.
We can only hope that some big players like Apple can prevent the deal.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 4:22 pm
by Heater
gkreidl,
Analysts speculate that they plan to enhance the licence fees for ARM chips
No doubt.

Thing is, there are many players who were already p'ed off with ARM licensing. Especially the little guys wanting to make IoT devices. The cost of silicon is approaching zero. The friction of ARM licensing becomes significant . For this reason they support RISC V.
We can only hope that some big players like Apple can prevent the deal.
Nah. Apple has already shown how to turn it's products around from 6502, to 68000, to Power PC, to Intel and to ARM.

They may well put their weight behind RISC V as well.

Good by ARM, and thanks for all the fish.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:06 pm
by SteveDee
It seems to me that many of us have benefited from the efforts of the Arm team. If not from the improvements in car technology, or the performance of Smart phones, then at least by ownership of low cost computers like the Raspberry Pi (...or why would you be here?).

In the UK we also gain by Arm (presumably) paying the tax due on annual earnings ($660m last year), and the possibility of employment for the chosen few. Once ownership passes to an overseas company, anything can happen. It would be a shame if it all turned-to-worms.

Mr. Son is obviously very good at raising funds for such purposes (Softbank already has debts exceeding $100bn) and appears to be turned-on by risky projects. I'm not sure about the value of his assurances concerning increased UK employment, keeping the HQ in Cambridge, and (by implication) continuing to pay all tax due to HMRC.

But hey! its not a done-deal ...yet.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 7:42 pm
by jamesh
Blimey, such negativity on so little (or indeed, no) evidence.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:05 pm
by fruitoftheloom
jamesh wrote:Blimey, such negativity on so little (or indeed, no) evidence.
Quite so...

...Apple made a tentative approach to purchase ARM Holdings a few years ago, so Apple may want a company they help to start up 25 years back in their control.
.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:13 pm
by joan
Sounds like a great price for the existing share holders. I didn't realise ARM was worth so much.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:23 pm
by asandford
gkreidl wrote:...they have to pay 30% less than two weeks ago...
How did you work that out?

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:18 pm
by gkreidl
asandford wrote:
gkreidl wrote:...they have to pay 30% less than two weeks ago...
How did you work that out?
Currency exchange value between Japanese Yen and UK Sterling (according to German magazine Spiegel online).

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 11:55 pm
by asandford
gkreidl wrote: ...they have to pay 30% less than two weeks ago....
Over the last month, the rate has gone from a high of ~160 and a low of ~130, which is about 20%, but today is 141 - so ~12%

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:25 am
by fruitoftheloom

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:53 am
by SteveDee
jamesh wrote:Blimey, such negativity...
Thanks James, but I think it would be more interesting to hear your views on the thread subject.

Let me re-phrase: do you think it matters that Arm will/may be sold to an overseas company, or maybe you agree with someone who said to me yesterday "...it doesn't matter, we live in a global market".

The reason I am interested in this situation is because I'm very, very old. During the 1970s I witnessed our industrial base being dismantled. This happened for a number of reasons, but us Brits helped it along, as we used to run Britain down by saying we were unable to cash-in on our own inventions. We would invent something, and foreign companies would develop it and make mega-bucks.

During the 70s adults were quite happy to buy foreign cars and electronics, but then seemed to be surprised when their children reached 16 and were unable to join an apprenticeship or get some kind of job in engineering. This resulted in a couple of generations not even considering a career in engineering ("...no point, we're rubbish").

Is there such a thing as National Prestige? Do companies like Arm and products like the Raspberry Pi inspire young people? Does it matter that the Raspberry Pi is manufactured in Wales rather than China?

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 7:59 am
by PiGraham
Burngate wrote:At 1,742.85p each, even a couple'd be nice!

Apparently "Softbank is currently in debt to the tune of around $100bn" so $32 bn could be considered small change?
Hugely in debt, and not an R&D business. Some cause for concern perhaps.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:05 am
by PiGraham
gkreidl wrote:This is terrible...
We can only hope that some big players like Apple can prevent the deal.
Just supposing it is terrible, why would Apple be a better buyer? Wouldn't that hurt Arm business with all those Apple competitors?

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:25 am
by gkreidl
PiGraham wrote:
gkreidl wrote:This is terrible...
We can only hope that some big players like Apple can prevent the deal.
Just supposing it is terrible, why would Apple be a better buyer? Wouldn't that hurt Arm business with all those Apple competitors?
A company loosing money every day and which has no interest in chip design at all will buy ARM only for one reason; to get their hands on the license fees.
Best thing would be, if ARM remains independent. But some of the big players who need the ARM technology like Apple or Samsung could buy a decent percentage of shares to protect ARM.
BTW, Apple was one of the first investors into ARM in the early nineties.

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:33 am
by fruitoftheloom
gkreidl wrote: BTW, Apple was one of the first investors into ARM in the early nineties.
Yes a joint venture between Acorn Computers, Apple & VLSI Technology. The Apple Newton powered by ARM !!

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:36 am
by joan
gkreidl wrote:
PiGraham wrote:
gkreidl wrote:This is terrible...
We can only hope that some big players like Apple can prevent the deal.
Just supposing it is terrible, why would Apple be a better buyer? Wouldn't that hurt Arm business with all those Apple competitors?
A company loosing money every day and which has no interest in chip design at all will buy ARM only for one reason; to get their hands on the license fees.
Best thing would be, if ARM remains independent. But some of the big players who need the ARM technology like Apple or Samsung could buy a decent percentage of shares to protect ARM.
BTW, Apple was one of the first investors into ARM in the early nineties.
If ARM was important to Apple they would have done so, likewise if ARM was important to the UK the UK would have done so. I'm not sure what is meant to be lost by someone else owning the IP. Aren't patents traded every day?

Re: Arm to be sold to Japanese

Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 8:39 am
by bensimmo
SteveDee wrote:...

Is there such a thing as National Prestige? Do companies like Arm and products like the Raspberry Pi inspire young people? Does it matter that the Raspberry Pi is manufactured in Wales rather than China?
By a Japanese company.

No it doesn't matter, other than it's easier to talk and have quick access in a local plant and gives local jobs.
It doesn't alter the product, both my A+ from both places work just the same.