OSIAS
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Windows 10 SD Image download

Mon May 18, 2015 5:58 pm

So I see that Windows 10 IoT is out but I also see its circus to get it installed and running on an PI. So I have to have Windows 10 on my main PC before I can test it on a Pi. Seems sorta silly.

Has no one in the community not already gone through this process and then imaged there flash card and made it available for download? Like what others have done for other OS images? Is there something that will not allow us to do that?

I just cant put Windows 10 on one of my other machines, you could say I am lazy yes but I just refuse to do it.

Anyhow point me to a link to just grab a DL that I can just image on my SD card?

Well I have another question with this as well, I think I know the answer for. Just because we got windows running on this ARM Proc Pi doesn't mean it will run all windows programs. They will all have to be re-compiled for ARM processors as well correct?

Thanks in advance

W. H. Heydt
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Mon May 18, 2015 6:37 pm

Or--to put it a little more mildly--it's a matter licensing and NDAs. Win10IoT for the Pi isn't really "out" in the conventional sense. It is available to developers who sign up with MS and agree to certain restrictive conditions. Among those conditions are ones barring redistribution. The licensing creates a contractual relationship and violating that contract can have consequences. Note that violating the terms of a contract is a *civil* offense, not a criminal one (it can cost you money, but you won't end up in jail...unless you find a way to break a criminal law as well).

markrad_msft
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Mon May 18, 2015 7:25 pm

You do not need to install Windows 10 in order to write your Win10 IoT SD for RPi. See this thread that explains how to do it from Windows 7.

viewtopic.php?f=105&t=109160

Other than burning the SD card, everything else is possible from a VM running Windows 10. In fact it may even be possible to burn the SD card from a VM but your can't do that with Hyper-V.
Mark Radbourne | Microsoft | Windows 10 IoT Core Insider Preview Support | This posting is provided 'as is' with no warranties and confers no rights.

GerritV
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Mon May 18, 2015 10:53 pm

OSIAS wrote:So I see that Windows 10 IoT is out but I also see its circus to get it installed and running on an PI. So I have to have Windows 10 on my main PC before I can test it on a Pi. Seems sorta silly.

Has no one in the community not already gone through this process and then imaged there flash card and made it available for download? Like what others have done for other OS images? Is there something that will not allow us to do that?

I just cant put Windows 10 on one of my other machines, you could say I am lazy yes but I just refuse to do it.

Anyhow point me to a link to just grab a DL that I can just image on my SD card?

Well I have another question with this as well, I think I know the answer for. Just because we got windows running on this ARM Proc Pi doesn't mean it will run all windows programs. They will all have to be re-compiled for ARM processors as well correct?

Thanks in advance
What will not allow you to do it is the sheer laziness on your part. You ask others to do the work for you, including your research and reading.

There are more than a few threads here already that provide details and approaches to do this simple task. As part of learning, you need to read and comprehend first.

OSIAS
Posts: 28
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Tue May 19, 2015 4:23 am

Well i want to say thanks for confirming my understandings But seems like its gone downhill.

So carry on without me, cheers.

jamesh
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Tue May 19, 2015 7:57 am

Thread cleaned of cruft. Let's hope the OP hasn't been scared away by this unnecessary bitching.
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fruitoftheloom
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Tue May 19, 2015 8:03 am

OSIAS wrote:Well i want to say thanks for confirming my understandings But seems like its gone downhill.

So carry on without me, cheers.
Windows 10 IoT Core will never be a "Desktop" Operating System. MS needed to find a Platform with an ARMv7 to develop Apps, it just so happens they chose RPi ;)
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OSIAS
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:58 am

So i want to follow up and complain now that i got it running.

Windows 10 on the rpi is bs. There is no OS, there isnt even really a command prompt. It a remote shell that allows you to develop on it. So this whole big ooh look windows 10 will run on it is a straight up lie. Completly misleading. Its not a windows desktop, i wouldnt even label it a dos platform its all remote, i dunno why you would even do this. Its not windows 10 like you would have on the arm surface or standard pc.

Either way big disapointment.

ame
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 4:03 am

OSIAS wrote:So i want to follow up and complain now that i got it running.

Windows 10 on the rpi is bs. There is no OS, there isnt even really a command prompt. It a remote shell that allows you to develop on it. So this whole big ooh look windows 10 will run on it is a straight up lie. Completly misleading. Its not a windows desktop, i wouldnt even label it a dos platform its all remote, i dunno why you would even do this. Its not windows 10 like you would have on the arm surface or standard pc.

Either way big disapointment.
Gasp! Say it isn't so! Who could possibly have predicted this?

fruitoftheloom
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 4:18 am

OSIAS wrote:So i want to follow up and complain now that i got it running.

Windows 10 on the rpi is bs. There is no OS, there isnt even really a command prompt. It a remote shell that allows you to develop on it. So this whole big ooh look windows 10 will run on it is a straight up lie. Completly misleading. Its not a windows desktop, i wouldnt even label it a dos platform its all remote, i dunno why you would even do this. Its not windows 10 like you would have on the arm surface or standard pc.

Either way big disapointment.
Microsoft or RPF never stated it was anything more than a development platform for IoT, it was media hype
which gave the wrong impression, so why you keep moaning is beyond comprehnsion.

The section of this forum is clearly labelled ""Windows 10 for IoT"

Whilst MS clearly state ""Windows 10 IoT Core""

It would appear from your other 'RANT" you bought the RPi as a Desktop Replacement, unfortunately you
bought a product without researching and it is unfair to blame other people for your mistake mea culpa !

viewtopic.php?f=63&t=99549&p=690847#p690847
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SebastianM
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 8:53 am

OSIAS wrote:So i want to follow up and complain now that i got it running.

Windows 10 on the rpi is bs. There is no OS, there isnt even really a command prompt. It a remote shell that allows you to develop on it. So this whole big ooh look windows 10 will run on it is a straight up lie. Completly misleading. Its not a windows desktop, i wouldnt even label it a dos platform its all remote, i dunno why you would even do this. Its not windows 10 like you would have on the arm surface or standard pc.

Either way big disapointment.
Hey,

there are many links that Point to sites where it is clearly shown what you can expect after installing a Windows 10 IoT.
I cannot believe that you did not recognize them going through the process of preparing the SD Card....

However fortunately there are other OSs available :!:
Battleship scale model: https://www.icloud.com/sharedalbum/de-de/#A55oqs3q4mFHQ

jamesh
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 9:19 am

OSIAS wrote:So i want to follow up and complain now that i got it running.

Windows 10 on the rpi is bs. There is no OS, there isnt even really a command prompt. It a remote shell that allows you to develop on it. So this whole big ooh look windows 10 will run on it is a straight up lie. Completly misleading. Its not a windows desktop, i wouldnt even label it a dos platform its all remote, i dunno why you would even do this. Its not windows 10 like you would have on the arm surface or standard pc.

Either way big disapointment.
My initial thoughts on reading this. RTFM. Everything you complain about was clearly written about here and in other places. The blog on here where it was launched was extremely clear in what it was. It is out of the control of the Foundation to control what others say about it, as I am sure you are aware, but on here, it was made abundantly clear this was NOT desktop Win10, but IoT Win10. So to come here are start complaining about it not being desktop Win10 is, well, how to put this politely, not the wisest approach, when even the smallest amount of research would have made things clear.
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fruitoftheloom
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 9:55 am

Yes found the original Blog https://www.raspberrypi.org/windows-10-for-iot

The title is clear, and the RPF Website is the best place to obtain information ;)
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OSIAS
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 1:43 pm

No I did not buy the pi for Win10 Desktop environment. Lets see I already own roughly 15 pi's and use them for all sorts of different purposes and platforms. With that many it means I have a couple sitting around idle, I figured why not check out this Windows 10 I am hearing about. I am no dummy in the tech world I mess around and have at my disposal pretty much anything server hardware/software related, we are talking 100k Plus servers and mainframes.

What I do not have is gobs of time to dedicate to hobby projects like this to completely geek out and read every little thing of research I can. I read a little bit about it, scanned over some articles, did some searches couldn't find everything I wanted and to me it seemed like windows wanted to break into the arm environment with some sort of OS / Desktop. Its not a big leap to imagine when they already have surfaces in the arm format and lets see all the windows phones gee whiz put two and two together.

They are already moving towards an all in one operating system in previous renditions why wouldn't anyone expect to see them come out with a desktop OS for arm. Again all in n one consistency across all platforms like windows 8 sorta did. Lets also not forget how they have said Windows 10 is the last OS and its sorta of free. To elaborate further Windows 10 "IOT" doesn't mean anything to me. I see as a tech "windows 10", okay that's a desktop OS. I have never heard of any environment with windows labeled on it in which it was not a desktop environment.

On threads I begin I like to finish with my results and not leave the reader hanging like you will find in many forum threads articles etc

Am I upset, nope could really care less, disappointed definitely. Was just a little side project to check it out, its a bust oh well.

Whats actually upsetting is this thread was already cleaned up once I saw all the posts go by by, This forum appears to be a bunch of troll snobs looking for an argument to prove themselves as superior. I do not think this is why they built the pi and why there are beginners forums etc.

Good Day

fruitoftheloom
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 2:40 pm

Retired disgracefully.....
This at present is my daily "computer" https://www.asus.com/us/Chrome-Devices/Chromebit-CS10/

hippy
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 2:44 pm

fruitoftheloom wrote:Yes found the original Blog https://www.raspberrypi.org/windows-10-for-iot

The title is clear, and the RPF Website is the best place to obtain information ;)
That may be so, but that wasn't the original blog announcement of Windows 10 on the Pi. That is here -

https://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale
Because it has an ARMv7 processor, it can run the full range of ARM GNU/Linux distributions, including Snappy Ubuntu Core, as well as Microsoft Windows 10.

Windows 10

For the last six months we’ve been working closely with Microsoft to bring the forthcoming Windows 10 to Raspberry Pi 2. Microsoft will have much more to share over the coming months. The Raspberry Pi 2-compatible version of Windows 10 will be available free of charge to makers.
While links did go to Microsoft's IoT pages, it is easy to see why people got the wrong end of the stick, took that as an announcement of some form of a desktop Windows 10 coming to the Pi rather than what Windows 10 IoT actually is.

The term "Windows 10" was used throughout rather than "Windows 10 IoT" and there were plenty of opportunities to explicitly state this was not a desktop OS but something else which were never taken. The FAQ does state; "Is this a full version of Windows 10? Please refer to WindowsOnDevices.com" but that is far more obtuse than the obvious "no" answer which could have been given.

The cynics and conspiracy theorists would probably suggest it was deliberately done as it was simply to generate publicity. I don't know but it seems to me the Foundation could have made the announcement in such a way that it was far clearer this was not desktop Windows 10 coming to the Pi.

Joe Schmoe
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:08 pm

This is a clear-cut case of people failing to do the one thing necessary to knowledge and clarity on the net:

Just read Joe Schmoe's posting and be educated.

Every post I've made since the beginning about Win 10 states clearly that:

1) It isn't a desktop OS - therefore, it is clearly WINO (Windows in name only) and thus utterly useless to the average user.

2) (Even if it did have a desktop), it won't run your existing (x86) software, so it is thus utterly useless to the average user.

All anyone had to do was google up postings by Joe Schmoe about Win 10 on the Pi, and then there would basically be no (zip, zero, nada) posts on this forum about Win 10.
And some folks need to stop being fanboys and see the forest behind the trees.

(One of the best lines I've seen on this board lately)

Joe Schmoe
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:09 pm

Also, love the bit above about "doth protest too much".

Says a lot about the OP.
And some folks need to stop being fanboys and see the forest behind the trees.

(One of the best lines I've seen on this board lately)

jamesh
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:12 pm

hippy wrote:
fruitoftheloom wrote:Yes found the original Blog https://www.raspberrypi.org/windows-10-for-iot

The title is clear, and the RPF Website is the best place to obtain information ;)
That may be so, but that wasn't the original blog announcement of Windows 10 on the Pi. That is here -

https://www.raspberrypi.org/raspberry-pi-2-on-sale
Because it has an ARMv7 processor, it can run the full range of ARM GNU/Linux distributions, including Snappy Ubuntu Core, as well as Microsoft Windows 10.

Windows 10

For the last six months we’ve been working closely with Microsoft to bring the forthcoming Windows 10 to Raspberry Pi 2. Microsoft will have much more to share over the coming months. The Raspberry Pi 2-compatible version of Windows 10 will be available free of charge to makers.
While links did go to Microsoft's IoT pages, it is easy to see why people got the wrong end of the stick, took that as an announcement of some form of a desktop Windows 10 coming to the Pi rather than what Windows 10 IoT actually is.

The term "Windows 10" was used throughout rather than "Windows 10 IoT" and there were plenty of opportunities to explicitly state this was not a desktop OS but something else which were never taken. The FAQ does state; "Is this a full version of Windows 10? Please refer to WindowsOnDevices.com" but that is far more obtuse than the obvious "no" answer which could have been given.

The cynics and conspiracy theorists would probably suggest it was deliberately done as it was simply to generate publicity. I don't know but it seems to me the Foundation could have made the announcement in such a way that it was far clearer this was not desktop Windows 10 coming to the Pi.
Part of the problem is that the Foundation didn't really know what was going to be in it until close on release time, because it wasn't really anything to do with them. It's a MS project, and always has been. SO until MS came up with the specs, it wasn't really possible to know how much would be available. But ever since release, it HAS been known and fairly well publicised. So the information made available over the time the download has been made available is completely correct. Information prior to that was limited to the known facts.
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jamesh
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:18 pm

OSIAS wrote: They are already moving towards an all in one operating system in previous renditions why wouldn't anyone expect to see them come out with a desktop OS for arm. Again all in n one consistency across all platforms like windows 8 sorta did. Lets also not forget how they have said Windows 10 is the last OS and its sorta of free. To elaborate further Windows 10 "IOT" doesn't mean anything to me. I see as a tech "windows 10", okay that's a desktop OS. I have never heard of any environment with windows labeled on it in which it was not a desktop environment.
Here are some non-desktop versions of Windows...

Windows CE
Windows Phone
Windows Media Centre
Windows RT
Windows tablet edition
Windows Mobile

Full lists here..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mi ... s_versions

That site lists Win10 having a non-desktop version.
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Joe Schmoe
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Fri May 29, 2015 3:30 pm

Here are some non-desktop versions of Windows...

Windows CE
Windows Phone
Windows Media Centre
Windows RT
Windows tablet edition
Windows Mobile
Ya gotta love these people (and I've seen a lot of them on online forums) who say:

I'm a big deal techie - I know everything techie.
But I'm so busy (because I'm such a big deal techie, doncha know...) that I don't have time to read anything.
And some folks need to stop being fanboys and see the forest behind the trees.

(One of the best lines I've seen on this board lately)

Starstruck
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Sat May 30, 2015 2:32 am

To elaborate further Windows 10 "IOT" doesn't mean anything to me. I see as a tech "windows 10", okay that's a desktop OS
I think this is the misunderstanding that many people are having and why they think it is useless.

Personally I think this is a smart move by Microsoft. IOT standards for the Internet Of Things, this is where small, low power computers / microcontrollers gather information from hundreds of connected devices. This could be you fridge, your electricity meter, your heating system etc which gives you the ability to monitor and/or control pretty much anything. IOT is predicted to be a huge growth area in the coming years and releasing an operating system on the PI that allows the huge pool of Microsoft Visual Studio developers out there to easily throw together the code to monitor how much beer is left in you fridge could give Microsoft great market penetration.

Windows 10 IOT is only designed to have one application running whenever it is turned on and is not supposed to be a desktop environment to replace linux etc. And from an IOT perspective that's better as more processor power is given to the application software rather than the OS which is doing a whole bunch of stuff that you dont need or use.

I do however agree with the original concept of having this as an image rather than having to go thru the install process. It seems more efficient to me that rather than have thousands of people creating images and burning time when they could release an image and then your done. Maybe that will come in the future.

Heater
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Sat May 30, 2015 3:28 am

The confusion over what Windows 10 IoT is or is not seems inevitable to me. It's such a misnomer. Firstly it has no Windows and secondly it's not much to do with the internet of things. The "10" just adds to the expectations.

As for the downloading of a ready made image MS could have done it like resin.io does. Go to their web site, sign up and create an account, tell it what hardware you have, raspi, beagle bone, Edison etc and what type of network connection. It then builds a minimal OS image for you which you download and burn to SD. Boot that and your Pi is now on the net and connected to resin.io from where you can push application code to it. Quick and easy. No special OS or IDE required on the desktop PC.

I dare say MS is heading in that direction, with the usual Windows as host OS strings attached.
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

slate_dk
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Sat May 30, 2015 9:58 am

Some misinformation in this thread.

What we have is: Windows 10 IoT for small devices
- free for makers and commercial device builders.
- it have the option to run one Universal app at a time; but can run multiple non-gui applications (well I expect it too)

There are two larger versions of Windows 10 IoT... which you have to buy.
According to this article: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9099/micr ... 0-iot-skus
the middle tier: Windows 10 IoT for mobile devices is also for ARM; will it run on a Pi2?

Heater
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Re: Windows 10 SD Image download

Sat May 30, 2015 11:12 am

Except that it is not free. I cannot get started with it for less than about $100 dollars.
Memory in C++ is a leaky abstraction .

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