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by RichardRussell
Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:56 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

I don't want to pick on you in particularly but this kind of statement drive me crazy. Sorry, but you are missing the point. The whole purpose of a challenge, surely, is to be able to make some judgement about the strengths and weaknesses of one language compared with another. An excellent example ...
by RichardRussell
Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:00 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

The goal is to show how desktop GUI is done. The editor challenge is just the stage for that goal. You can do whatever you like with my program (SDLIDE.bbc) and the associated library (dlglib.bbc). Both are written entirely in BBC BASIC and there is no reliance on any external GUI library, framewor...
by RichardRussell
Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:13 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

Could it be used to edit non-BBC BASIC? The syntax colouring and indentation are BBC BASIC-specific, of course, and there is a line-length limit of about 250 characters. Apart from that it will probably be OK with source code for a different BASIC (e.g. ScriptBasic), you did ask for a 'code editor'...
by RichardRussell
Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:37 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

Any chance the both of you could collaborate on a submission? If you are happy to accept an existing program, rather than something written specifically for the challenge, then my SDLIDE.bbc meets the requirements as I understand them: Menu: YES Toolbar: YES Rich Text edit control: Not Rich Text bu...
by RichardRussell
Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:49 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

I mean, what is a window? It's a region of memory that you draw to. The only OS-dependent code would be getting and displaying that surface and BBC BASIC uses SDL2 for that, I'd imagine. Everything else such as mouse movement/clicks, keyboard usage should be exposed to the user in any decent BASIC....
by RichardRussell
Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:37 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

How do I do that? How do I create a window, handle menus, handle Window Manager events, handle messages, etc in a way that is OS independant without using libraries, while maintaining compatibility with RISC OS? By doing everything in BASIC! BBC BASIC is more than capable of implementing the full s...
by RichardRussell
Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:38 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

And the reason I am hesitant to make a submission, as I would be using native code and doing so in BBC BASIC V on RISC OS. Unless you want to use embedded assembler code, it ought to be relatively easy to write it in 'generic' BBC BASIC so that it will run in BBC BASIC for Windows , BBC BASIC for S...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:31 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

After all, the spirit of the challenge is to actually show how the language's code looks, how readable it is, etc. True, but the opportunity for showcasing a language's 'unique' features is limited if you are constrained by the interface imposed by GMP. I reckon the BBC BASIC Fibo program is quite ...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:47 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

ScriptBasic and I had a disagreement about this. But I decided that if a big integer module was created for ScriptBasic and included in the standard install, then it would qualify. No matter if it used GMP under the hood, that is an implementation detail at that point. It's that solution I was refe...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:05 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

I agree, otherwise one ends up with challenge entries that look like... Since you mention it, I felt that it was a flaw of the Fibonacci challenge too, as there was nothing to prevent a 'solution' consisting of calling GMP library routines. Writing a BigNum library from scratch in BBC BASIC (which ...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 10, 2019 4:19 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

I agree, otherwise one ends up with challenge entries that look like #!/bin/sh exec emacs "$@" Quite. It ends up being a test of how easy it is to embed a library widget, which ought either to be straightforward (if the language supports that kind of thing) or impossible (if everything is sandboxed...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:14 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

If you don't want to participate, that's fine too. The kind of challenge that would be more likely to attract a submission from me is one that specifies that only native code (including supplied standard libraries) can be used, in other words specifically excluding the use of external libraries and...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:07 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

ScriptBasic wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:51 pm
Check out the spec. for the GUI Editor challenge
The only spec I can find refers to 'Rich Text edit control' and 'predefined dialogs'. That appears to rule out a native code solution (in BBC BASIC or anything else) since by definition it won't be using any 'predefined' library widgets.
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:37 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

ScriptBasic wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:56 pm
Will you be submitting a GUI editor for the challenge?
What challenge? I generally don't take an interest in challenges (I leave that to my users). The Liberty BASIC GUI editor FreeForm will be hard to beat (it runs in my LB Booster too), if existing programs are eligible.
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:37 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Introduction to BBC BASIC
Replies: 579
Views: 43955

Re: Introduction to BBC BASIC

In another thread, about another BASIC (!), there are some examples of how to incorporate GUI features from a toolkit like GTK or IUP. Whilst you can do that (in BBC BASIC too if you want to) it seems to me that it's neither a good demonstration of the capabilities of your BASIC nor conducive to gua...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 03, 2019 12:50 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: SB-IUP
Replies: 18
Views: 2385

Re: SB-IUP

ScriptBasic wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 4:01 am
This is what the ScriptBasic for Windows IDE/Debugger looks like. It was written in VB6.
The ScriptBasic IDE/Debugger was written in Visual BASIC? I've heard it all now! :roll:
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 03, 2019 12:01 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

The problem is scaling to one texture using nearest neighbour to get the integer scale, then scaling that texture up onto the screen using bilinear. I can get it to work on one of my windows boxes, but not the other two - nor can my 2015 MBP do it either which is disappointing. I'm pretty sure that...
by RichardRussell
Wed Jul 03, 2019 8:33 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

Even many general utilties in BBC BASIC make heavy use of graphics. I agree that when you know you always have graphics available, irrespective of the platform on which it is running, there is a temptation to 'enhance' programs that don't really need any graphics at all with a splash of color or so...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:48 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

I would love to add an OpenGL shader to SpecBAS. Not for the display per-se, but for scaling to an integer multiple before using bilinear to get the rest of the way up to the screen size. Much nicer to look at than a straight bilinear filter :) Is there no way you can achieve that by judiciously sw...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:56 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

Are users of BBC BASIC more graphics centric (games, ...) then general purpose utility programming? That's very difficult to say, and I have no way of discovering any reliable statistics. It was probably the case back in the early days (i.e. 1980s) because the graphics (and sound etc.) capabilities...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:17 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

one core to render the graphics and have the interpreter running on a separate core That's the BBC BASIC for SDL 2.0 structure too, but with the addition of the GPU (which has hundreds or thousands of 'cores'). Admittedly where the benefit of the hardware acceleration really kicks in is in things l...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 2:53 pm
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

Interesting. I wonder if it can be made to work with SpecBAS's blend modes too (OVER command). That has been (and continues to be) an issue for BBC BASIC. I don't know what blend modes SpecBAS supports but BBC BASIC has the traditional 'bitwise' OR, AND, XOR and NOT operations (where the 'existing'...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:45 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

The GPU is good at that kind of thing as well as blitting textures. In addition, SDL 2.0.10 (in pre-release) is introducing two new features which will boost its benefits over software rendering: Render batching. Rather than submitting each render command individually to the backend, SDL 2.0.10 wil...
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:32 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

ZXDunny wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:28 am
Graphics? You mean things like drawing lines and circles?
Yes, for example, and the rest. The GPU is good at that kind of thing as well as blitting textures. You could compare the speed of SDL_RenderDrawLines or SDL_RenderFillRect when using the GPU compared with software rendering.
by RichardRussell
Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:16 am
Forum: Other programming languages
Topic: Searching for BASIC
Replies: 126
Views: 7049

Re: Searching for BASIC

ZXDunny wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:11 am
why do I want GPU acceleration?
I assume for the same reason I do in BBC BASIC, to make graphics faster! If you don't care about speed, it's a moot point.

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