Go to advanced search

by timrowledge
Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:25 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

1) So I installed squeak to Debian. The LSW on my Win 10 PC that should make no odds. $ apt-cache search squeak Oh, yuck. We really have to get this removed from Debian or make them actually include it properly. They completely and utterly failed to .. .oh, never mind. It's rubbish. Don't use that ...
by timrowledge
Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:31 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

If I read the Squeak blurb right, Squeak plus baremetal C, perhaps Circle, could run the VM on baremetal Pi's with GUI? Have not tried Squeak but if it was supposed to run on PDAs I'm interested ;) Dynabook :o Wow another blast from the past. When Kay proposed an extension as this research to Parc'...
by timrowledge
Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:56 am
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Ah yeah, perhaps I did not make that very clear. Yah. But currently I want to get a Smalltalk fibo(4784969) working on a Pi or in the Linux Subsytem for Windows on my PC. Then I can add a Smalltalk solution to the fibo(4784969) github repository: https://github.com/ZiCog/fibo_4784969 Okay, this mak...
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 7:39 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Heater wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 7:06 pm

I can only reach my Pi via SSH. Or there is the LSW terminal on my PC.
Wait a minute - I thought you were trying to run this stuff on a bare-metal-RISC-V-thing?
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 7:38 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Heater wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:58 pm
Yay! After 6 hours Tim's iterative fibo(4784969) produced a result on my PC.
Crikey; that does rather show up the difference in algorithms.
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:39 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Heater wrote:
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:32 pm
Great. All set with GCC and Clang here.
Any sort of display stuff ? Even a framebuffer ?
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:24 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

My question is how do I get it to do it for me? gst seems to be broken. So what next? I don't have much experience in trying to do commandline run stuff but I do know that some people do; I'll ask on the squeak forums to see if anyone has a plausible solution that won't use up too much effort. What...
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:48 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Too bad about Smalltalk, I have not used that before. Seems a bit old too, nothing new in Smalltalk land? Well let's see, Squeak is updated somewhat almost every day as people work on things, ditto the Pharo fork (aimed more at commercial needs), VA Smalltalk from Instantiations is still under acti...
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:16 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Or has anyone got a Smalltalk fibo(4784969) running on Raspbian/Debian? I'm certainly not going to defend the specific gnu implementation of Smalltalk - it's clearly sorely lacking. Generalising that to "Smalltalk can't do it" is a bit silly though. I've given a working implementation and results a...
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:45 am
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Tim, If I tweak your fibIterative so that it runs in GNU Smalltalk, like so: {snip} It does indeed produce the correct result. Do I have a bug in my code? The most likely bug I can think of is that you probably don't know that Smalltalk does *not* futz around with arithmetic stuff for precedence ru...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:21 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Hmm... what OS? My RISC V on FPGA has no OS. Sounds like this might be too big an idea for me. Well, we *have* made Squeak run on no-OS devices before but it can get a bit tedious when you have no real support system. One can, for example, display straight to a frame buffer whether local or remote,...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:58 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

Integer extend [ fibo [ | k fk fk1 | (self < 2) ifTrue: [ ^ self ]. (self = 2) ifTrue: [ ^ 1 ]. (self > 2) ifTrue: [ k := (self + 1) // 2. fk := k fibo. fk1 := (k - 1) fibo. (self odd) ifTrue: [ ^ (fk raisedToInteger: 2) + (fk1 raisedToInteger: 2) ] ifFalse: [ ^ ((2 * fk1) + fk) * fk. ] ] ] ] My ap...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:39 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?
Replies: 1770
Views: 69459

Re: Why Avoid BASIC on RPi?

So far I have failed to find any documentation on the limits of GNU Smalltalk Integers. Normally Smalltalk large integers are limited only by the amount of memory available; they're just damn great arrays of bytes. And in general they are processed with the help of some C code primitives that handl...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:23 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

No insult intended. Perhaps my statement is a bit harsh there and not sounding as jovial as I would like. Sorry; annoying day and not your fault. Unless ..... 1) Having been in and around programming since the early 1980's I have never seen anyone using Smalltalk. It has never shown up in any proje...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:07 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Thanks for that; gst is a mystery to me for previously stated reasons. GNU Smalltalk doesn't print anything unless told to so you would need to printNl the result to show it. Ah, ok. In a 'real' Smalltalk one would be running this code in a Workspace by selecting the '30 demoFib' and then using the ...
by timrowledge
Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:45 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Smalltalk may well have been doomed since that BYTE article. As were many other half baked ideas. Serously? You're going with bizarre insults now? I had hoped you were better -or at least funnier - that that. But all is not lost. Why not Smalltalk on RISC V? I have one here just waiting. It would b...
by timrowledge
Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:06 am
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Gnu Smalltalk is bit ... limited. Download Squeak from www.squeak.org instead. GST is missing the tools and environment that makes a good language a great system. Generally speaking nobody would choose to draw digital images by using a hex editor; why do the equivalent? Oh, almost forgot - I strongl...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:00 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Now, about your benchFib example above: 1) Could you explain what all that line noise means? Perhaps it's me but it's unintelligible. If I squint hard I can just about make out a recursive fibo in there. 2) How do I run it? It fails for me: $ cat fibo.st benchFib "Handy send-heavy benchmark" "(resu...
by timrowledge
Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:36 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

As you have noted there is plenty of doom to go around. If only I could find my Byte magazine https://ia802700.us.archive.org/BookReader/BookReaderImages.php?zip=/8/items/byte-magazine-1981-08/1981_08_BYTE_06-08_Smalltalk_jp2.zip&file=1981_08_BYTE_06-08_Smalltalk_jp2/1981_08_BYTE_06-08_Smalltalk_00...
by timrowledge
Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:59 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

timrowledge, ... Smalltalk. It's the only language good enough to be worth critiquing. Wow, that is a bold statement! It's pointless to make mealy-mouthed statements. Waste of breath. I notice Smalltalk accommodates LargeIntegers, that is a good start, you are invited to contribute a solution to th...
by timrowledge
Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:24 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

timrowledge, Did you know that Scratch comes in position 25 here? https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/ 0.549% of programmers are actually using it. Impressive, and incidentally, much higher than Smalltalk which doesn't come into the top 100 (though it is tracked). And the point is what, exactly? When...
by timrowledge
Thu Apr 04, 2019 12:02 am
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

The IBM 360 used microcode in 1964 to implement its instruction set on a RISC-like processor. And is therefore, in combination, not a RISC design. Arguably a prime example of CISC. Exactly. As it happens I knew (and indeed worked with in a minor way) John Cocke, the IBMer that was a key founder of ...
by timrowledge
Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:56 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Scratch is an environment for introducing people with no prior experience to the concept of programming a computer. Scratch is brilliant for that. I used it in exactly that way to demonstrate to someone what programming was about. Brilliant. Glad you like it - gerbils for courses, as we say. Instea...
by timrowledge
Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:51 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

I do like the idea of Scratch, it is just offensive to graphics trained me that the pieces don't fit together. Hmm, as a graduate of the Royal College of Art I'd agree - except that in 'real' Scratch as installed in Raspbian as "Scratch" rather than "Scratch 2", they *do* fit together And it is way...
by timrowledge
Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:31 pm
Forum: Off topic discussion
Topic: Is ARM doomed?
Replies: 298
Views: 11432

Re: Is ARM doomed?

Scratch is an environment for introducing people with no prior experience to the concept of programming a computer. Instead of dumping newcomers into a nightmare of stupid text editors and command line with ridiculous incantations that have to be properly spelled (sic) in order to do anything at all...

Go to advanced search